that the economy, that health care, that a lot of there things mattered more. like in 201, a lot of things mattered a whole lot more than reverend wright. it's not going to move swing voters at all. >> also in a certain way it's a triumph of -- as much as i'm irritated by these sort of pockets of racialized discourse that emerge, i think there's -- there's something triumph not final, not now we're in a post-racial america but something triumph about the idea that this president in 2008 was able to suggest to the american people these other things matter more than any particular negative association you have around race. >> but remember how he did that. this is one of the things i think is too often forgotten. he did it by talking about race. the way he actually got out of the reverend wright problem that he had was he actually, in philadelphia, delivered a speech on race in america and said, we have to have this discussion. and one of the things that he demonstrated is that you can be the black leader who talks about race if you talk about it well. and i think